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Dec 6, 2019

Re: Bose QC 35 Firmware 4.5.2 Noise Cancellation Investigation Discussion

FYI - I've downgraded as per your suggestion, and with my iPad volume at 50% while playing media, and headphones worn properly, I can STILL hear coughing and conversations in the next room. In order to eliminate all background noises, I have to crank up my iPad (or iPhone) media to almost 100% which of course is too much to tolerate. With sounds blasting in my ear, how can I focus on writing?

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Apr 2, 2020

Re: Bose QC 35 Firmware 4.5.2 Noise Cancellation Investigation Discussion

Morning Ladies and Gents,

 

After reading this constant 0-24 cry for months and months and months, I didn’t have other choice but registering to share my experience. 
Both of my QC35IIs  have “AZ” serial number, they came out of the box with 4.3.6 fw, no problems with the ANC. 
When I updated my first pair a few months ago I didn’t know about the ANC issues so went ahead and there was no problem or any changes to the ANC. 
When I bought my second pair a few weeks ago I already knew about the ANC issues so I was a little bit concerned regarding to the firmware update. So I left it on 4.3.6 which gave a perfect noise cancelling, was easily on par with my Bose NC700s  and Sony XM3s. 
But after reading the continuous crying comments  on this forum, I decided to go ahead and update, just on purpose to see what happens. Nothing. Apart from the latest 4.5.2 is now on my second pair as well. The noise cancelling as good as it was. There is still a significant difference between the “high”, “low” and “off” settings. In heavy windy conditions, on low setting the wind noise stops. On high, the wind comes back as it did before. Also on high setting they still block out so much noise , listening to music on moderate volumes, they  block out everything on a busy bus. Same as in a busy shopping centre. Even when I paused the music at Tescos and just toggled through the ANC levels, as soon as switched to high, I suddenly went deaf. 

 

I believe those people who have experienced this issue they either have a hardware fault or just their ears simply got used to, adapted to the noise cancelling levels, therefore it doesn’t seem as effective as it was at the beginning. 

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Mar 24, 2020

Re: Bose QC 35 Firmware 4.5.2 Noise Cancellation Investigation Discussion

Firstly, I would like to say thanks to the Bose Support Team for allowing us, users to downgrade our Bose QC 35 or QC 35 II products.

 

However, I would like to make a further suggestion, which is to add a feature on the Bose Connect app, which turns off the auto-update functions - which is very intrusive at times and makes the usability of the app unpleasant.

 

Hopefully this comment gains recognition from a Bose moderator.

 

Cheers.

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Apr 6, 2020

Re: Bose QC 35 Firmware 4.5.2 Noise Cancellation Investigation Discussion

Quick question guys: I recently bought the Version 1 of the headphones with a stoneage firmware version on it.

 

--> Is is also dangourus to update the QC35 v1 firmware? Thank you for your help

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Apr 30, 2019

Re: Bose QC 35 Firmware 4.5.2 Noise Cancellation Investigation Discussion

I’d say, if it ain’t broken don’t fix it. What would be your case to update it if you’ve got a great working device? 
You won’t suddenly get an airplane out of your headphones 😉

So, again. No problems? Leave them as is. 

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Apr 6, 2020

Re: Bose QC 35 Firmware 4.5.2 Noise Cancellation Investigation Discussion

Hi Everyone,

 

Here are my investigation and thoughts. (sorry for my english ;-))

I bought a QC35 II last july. During initial setup Bose app upgraded the firmware to 4.5.2.

So I never "heard" the ANC version 4.3.6 before.

 

I made a blind test with a friend changing firmware without telling me which one is active.

We test without any music or device connected. On ANC high level.

We test with a set of real noises (that's the point !), each separated, not like white noise.

For voice or phone, we play in loop same part of multiple youtube videos.

We made these tests a few times. changing times of the day (not same hour or test order)

- Very noisy environment (commercial center, plane, city street), no voice : identical results

- Repeated scratch on a wooden table or people walking on wood floor : v4.5.2 is better. 

- Loud (bass) noise, transport, ship : identical results.

- Openspace with people talking or on the phone : 4.3.6 is far better.
4.5.2 seems to have no ANC ! that's strange. In a sense that conversation are completely understandable, only their volume is reduced a bit.

With 4.3.6, we must concentrate to understand what is said.

On 4.5.2, if the person on the phone is walking on a wood floor, the sound of the floor is removed but not the "voice". Strange :-). It seems the medium frenquencies are less filtered in 4.5.2.

 

So, somewhat, there must has been a change in the way specific frequencies are filtered ...

 

Bose, is it possible to enhance your ANC to have a better removal of voices (conversation, plane announcement, ...) ?

 

Thanks

 

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Aug 13, 2019

Re: Bose QC 35 Firmware 4.5.2 Noise Cancellation Investigation Discussion


@Superphilo wrote:

Hi Everyone,

 

Here are my investigation and thoughts. (sorry for my english ;-))

I bought a QC35 II last july. During initial setup Bose app upgraded the firmware to 4.5.2.

So I never "heard" the ANC version 4.3.6 before.

 

I made a blind test with a friend changing firmware without telling me which one is active.

We test without any music or device connected. On ANC high level.

We test with a set of real noises (that's the point !), each separated, not like white noise.

For voice or phone, we play in loop same part of multiple youtube videos.

We made these tests a few times. changing times of the day (not same hour or test order)

- Very noisy environment (commercial center, plane, city street), no voice : identical results

- Repeated scratch on a wooden table or people walking on wood floor : v4.5.2 is better. 

- Loud (bass) noise, transport, ship : identical results.

- Openspace with people talking or on the phone : 4.3.6 is far better.
4.5.2 seems to have no ANC ! that's strange. In a sense that conversation are completely understandable, only their volume is reduced a bit.

With 4.3.6, we must concentrate to understand what is said.

On 4.5.2, if the person on the phone is walking on a wood floor, the sound of the floor is removed but not the "voice". Strange :-). It seems the medium frenquencies are less filtered in 4.5.2.

 

So, somewhat, there must has been a change in the way specific frequencies are filtered ...

 

Bose, is it possible to enhance your ANC to have a better removal of voices (conversation, plane announcement, ...) ?

 

Thanks

 


Your findings align with this test. It could be that mid-range frequencies (where the human voice sits) are less dampened in the newer firmwares, thus making the ANC effect less strong. @bose could you see if the QA testers could create some frequency plots with and without ANC for a full frequency spectrum, for the 3.x and 4.x firmwares compared?

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Lead Community Manager

Re: Bose QC 35 Firmware 4.5.2 Noise Cancellation Investigation Discussion

Hey everyone,

 

Once again, we appreciate all the discussion in this thread! There have been a lot of really well-thought-out posts in here, and some questions and topics we would like to address.

 

Why we did not allow downgrade past 4.3.6:

There are a number of reasons we did not implement a downgrade option below the previous firmware release. The main reason is for security. We’ve implemented a number of enhancements to security and cannot revert beyond those updates. The other major reason is because in some cases downgrading would also break or disable certain functionality. These include any added features, reverting interoperability improvements between the headphones and sources, reversing bug fixes we have made since, as well as possibly introducing new ones since we don’t validate previous version of firmware against new operating systems.

 

Third-Party Testing:

Regarding any tests performed by third parties, we are not able to comment on their findings as we don’t have enough detail about test setups and procedures. We simply cannot know what is done in outside evaluations. There are a number of variables that we control in our testing and we have access to test points in the system signal path that are not accessible to 3rd party test labs.  We can test each subsystem independently, evaluate subsystem calibration values, and measure the underlying physical acoustic building blocks. 

 

What I can say is due to the rigorous testing procedures we follow, we are confident in our findings.

 

Regarding the sample size of the Extended Engineering Evaluation:

The 10 headphones we tested in this section were from our in-home visits and returned from customers. The users of all 10 of these headsets reported experiencing the issue representative of the reports we got from the community, however they were not the only headsets we tested. We tested numerous headsets over the years, starting back in 2017 when this issue was first reported. Additionally, we’ve also tested thousands of headphones sent back to us through our remanufacturing process. These headphones, which have many different firmware versions installed, are rerun through a factory test process, which would catch any issues with the firmware functionality.

 

Getting returned headphones from customers reporting the specific concerns with ANC was a challenge. We made every effort and several requests to find volunteers so we could collect more headphones throughout the process, including making a community thread specifically for that purpose. We are very thankful to those who were willing to send us their headset and allowed us to visit them, and while we would have loved to test more units specifically against the reported ANC issue, very few people were willing to send us their headsets directly.  

 

Noise Cancellation:

For anyone still experiencing noise cancellation issues, there’s a few things we hope you keep in mind.  Seemingly small things, like a single unsnapped tab on an earcushion can have a dramatic impact on noise cancelling performance. Please watch this helpful service video as it covers a range of tips to ensure your headphones are performing at their best. Also, make sure to read the Overview of Bose Noise Reduction Technology as we feel it provides a good high-level insight into what noise reduction is.

 

Lastly, I want to call out @atropos for asking some great questions. I am working with our engineers to make sure we can get detailed answers to your well-thought-out questions.

 

Thanks!

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Apr 6, 2020

Re: Bose QC 35 Firmware 4.5.2 Noise Cancellation Investigation Discussion

That is exactly what i am doing unless it is clear, it will not make it worse. 😉

 

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Apr 3, 2020

Re: Bose QC 35 Firmware 4.5.2 Noise Cancellation Investigation Discussion

Wayne,

What does security and functionality have to do with anything? You are testing ANC in a lab not whether you have the latest function button options!

3.x should have been tested regardless. Most of us who have ANC issues upgraded to 4.5.2 from 3.x

 

I noticed issues straight after upgrading and stumbled across this website when searching last week. Clearly this isn't an ear cushion problem otherwise v3.x would have been the same for me.

 

Disappointing - these things are not cheap and now the main selling point has been significantly altered. These headphones belong to us - we should be able to downgrade the firmware. Mine were working perfectly fine without the "enhancements" you talk about in 4.5.2.