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Re: Subwoofer for S1 Pro

Well put Oldghm

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Jan 18, 2013

Re: Subwoofer for S1 Pro

I look forward to hear what Bose has to say within this thread...Clearly they will not disclose their plans but it seems that we have identified a new product idea that customers want and need. Everyone have great gigs this weekend. 

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Re: Subwoofer for S1 Pro

Bose is understandably quiet when it comes to upcoming/new product announcements such as this so I doubt we will hear anything from them at this point. 

However, there were a lot of great ideas put forth that I’m sure Bose R&D are listening to that might feed plans they may have in this S1/sub area. The amount of responses clearly indicates a need. 

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Re: Subwoofer for S1 Pro

I'll volunteer to be a beta tester...

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Re: Subwoofer for S1 Pro

I´m not so sure if Bose indicates a need to bring another sub on the market.

Bose would have to create a new sub with a built-in x-over and a mixer but there are already so many of such subs on the market, some of them quite cheap and a cheap market is usually not a market Bose likes to serve.

Or Bose has to reengineer the S1 pro completely with an internal x-over and a bass out AND create a new active sub.

Aside from having the Bose name on the sub there is not much to gain for Bose or Bose users.

You can add a sub to the S1 pro easily and the Behringer B1200 is one of many and one of the cheapest and most reasonable solutions. It has a stereo x-over and even a tone control if you need that, it’s loud enough and portable.

It doesn’t run on batteries but you will have a hard time to find a 500 W sub that runs on battery. Of course you can build something with a car battery and a converter.

 You’ll lose a good part of the portability if you add a sub but if you need more bass for some events, the B1200 is an easy way to get it. 2 S1 pros and 1 or 2 subs would be very flexible. (I think one B1200 is enough but try yourself). There is also a RCF Sub702 if you want easy transportation and more power as the B1200 provides.

You’ll lose the internal mixer of the S1 pro but there so many little mixers on the market, including some Bose mixers. Also, if you have 2 S1 pros you can one one’s mixer, run the signal out into the subwoofer and from there into the second S1 pro. Of course the first S1 will fart out a while before the sub/S1 combination.

I like the S1 as it is. If I need more bass, I add it or, if I need much more power, I take another pa. I'm not really missing anything.

 

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Re: Subwoofer for S1 Pro

Hey Guys,

In my search for a personal solution i`m going to build this, think it will work.

Imagine, 2x S1 Pro on 40% volume, S1 Line out boosted with the HA400 for good A1 power, Rolls for the filtering of only <150Hz, all build and wired in the B1, with a new connector panel at the rear for line in and 220V..

 

Me like..!!

 

 

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Jan 18, 2013

Re: Subwoofer for S1 Pro

PZ posted:

I´m not so sure if Bose indicates a need to bring another sub on the market.

Bose would have to create a new sub with a built-in x-over and a mixer but there are already so many of such subs on the market, some of them quite cheap and a cheap market is usually not a market Bose likes to serve.

Or Bose has to reengineer the S1 pro completely with an internal x-over and a bass out AND create a new active sub.

Aside from having the Bose name on the sub there is not much to gain for Bose or Bose users.

You can add a sub to the S1 pro easily and the Behringer B1200 is one of many and one of the cheapest and most reasonable solutions. It has a stereo x-over and even a tone control if you need that, it’s loud enough and portable.

It doesn’t run on batteries but you will have a hard time to find a 500 W sub that runs on battery. Of course you can build something with a car battery and a converter.

 You’ll lose a good part of the portability if you add a sub but if you need more bass for some events, the B1200 is an easy way to get it. 2 S1 pros and 1 or 2 subs would be very flexible. (I think one B1200 is enough but try yourself). There is also a RCF Sub702 if you want easy transportation and more power as the B1200 provides.

You’ll lose the internal mixer of the S1 pro but there so many little mixers on the market, including some Bose mixers. Also, if you have 2 S1 pros you can one one’s mixer, run the signal out into the subwoofer and from there into the second S1 pro. Of course the first S1 will fart out a while before the sub/S1 combination.

I like the S1 as it is. If I need more bass, I add it or, if I need much more power, I take another pa. I'm not really missing anything.

 

You have raised some points of interest here. I have multiple systems that I can plug in. Thats covered....what I now have is a completely wireless mobile solution. I have a wireless mic connected to Ch 1 of the S1. A wireless Guitar connected to Ch 2 and my iPad streaming to the Bluetooth input Ch 3. 

I have everything in a pelican case including a small collapsible mic stand and an iPad holder. Boom. I could play in the middle of the woods if I wanted to entertain the squirrels. 

You say there is not a need for a battery powered sub? I disagree. 

The only shortcoming of my above mentioned wireless mobile system is lack of low end. If I use any of my powered subs which I have multiple options it defeats the purpose for this particular use case. 

And I will extend this use case even further by introducing the need to travel by air to certain gigs. I can fit my S1 in a suitcase (Hardshell Pelican) but I need that Sub in my 2nd suitcase. Southwest two bags fly free up to 50 lbs each. 

I want to control what I play through as part of my quality control approach to my sound. Lots of people don't give a hoot what they play through or how it really sounds. They just show up, play, get their money and run.....but that ain't me. 

So this final piece to the puzzle is a battery powered sub. I don't know where you came up with the 500 Watt requirement. All the Bose subs run 250 watts I believe. So this sub could be 250 Watt or less even. I think the biggest challenge is making the sub light weight and small enough to fit in luggage which is one of my VOICE OF THE CUSTOMER requests.

I do lots of other small gigs where I would leave the compact or L1 at home and use this system....if I only had a sub. 

Guess we will see...the way I see it if you want to talk economics, Bose would sell a portable Battery powered sub to most every S1 buyer, and I for one would also buy a 2nd S1. Sounds like a great $$$ niche that no one is fulfilling....

 

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Re: Subwoofer for S1 Pro

Moon Dog,

sorry, I wasn't clear. I didn't mean there is no need for a battery powered sub, just there is no need for another non-battery powered sub especially for the S1 pro.

The problem with a battery powered sub is the battery. You are also right, 200 watts should be enough and should give us around 112-115 dB SPL. I think even half of this could work. The 500W were only an example because rhe cjeap Berry has this wattage. Ther is only a difference of 3dB SPL between 500 and 250 watts.

But let's compute: 120W/12V = 10 A. For 6 hours we would like to have 60 amphours (Ah). I'm not talking about output but current consumption.

At least 25% capacity should be left in the battery otherwise it will be damaged. Thus we need a 75 Ah battery for a sub with a 120 watt power supply. There are car and boat batteries that have such capacities or more, but they are big and heavy.

Also, if Bose provides us with a 120 watts sub I'm sure many customers will argue that a sub needs at least 1000 watts, because they have heard so. 🙂

Anyway, it's doable. Take a small sub, a car battery and a pure sine converter, put it on a trolly and have fun in the middle of the woods. If you go this route check the inrush current of the product because that can be much higher than the

But I think you will get into troubles with such big batteries in a plane. Depending on the technology they can get explosive. Maybe you can just buy the pure sine converter and rent a battery if you have to fly to your gig.

I think it's great that you really care about your sound and hope you find what you need!!!

all the best

Peter

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Mar 16, 2015

Re: Subwoofer for S1 Pro

Per my previous posts, I'd love to see Bose come out with a battery powered bass unit to work with the S1 Pro.  That said, I have a question.

For the acoustic guitar/vocal performers, what is it that's missing from your sound when using S1 Pro for PA?  Looking at the specs, it appears to me that for acoustic guitar and vocals, the S1 Pro speakers should more than adequate to handle any of the frequencies that would be produced.

In my case, I'm using 2 S1 Pros with a T4 mixer.   Even though I can EQ this to the Nth degree, and it sounds good, it still feels like something is missing and  I can't put my finger on what it is. It's clear but kind of "thin" for lack of a better word.   Like I said, technically, the S1 Pros should be more than enough for the acoustic performer in all frequencies, low to hi.

What do other acoustic performers think?

Normally, I have bass and treble on the S1 set at 1200.  I haven't tried this yet but when I get back home in a week or so, I'll try turning the bass up on the S1s and see if that helps.

 

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Jan 18, 2013

Re: Subwoofer for S1 Pro

KingBiscuit posted:

Per my previous posts, I'd love to see Bose come out with a battery powered bass unit to work with the S1 Pro.  That said, I have a question.

For the acoustic guitar/vocal performers, what is it that's missing from your sound when using S1 Pro for PA?  Looking at the specs, it appears to me that for acoustic guitar and vocals, the S1 Pro speakers should more than adequate to handle any of the frequencies that would be produced.

In my case, I'm using 2 S1 Pros with a T4 mixer.   Even though I can EQ this to the Nth degree, and it sounds good, it still feels like something is missing and  I can't put my finger on what it is. It's clear but kind of "thin" for lack of a better word.   Like I said, technically, the S1 Pros should be more than enough for the acoustic performer in all frequencies, low to hi.

What do other acoustic performers think?

Normally, I have bass and treble on the S1 set at 1200.  I haven't tried this yet but when I get back home in a week or so, I'll try turning the bass up on the S1s and see if that helps.

 

Hey KingBiscuit.....cool name....

I have the ability to mix and match lots of PA components since I am the Bose poster child here in Phoenix. For a recently small show indoors (on a boat), to prepare, at home, I setup a few different combinations of speakers and played through it. I did use the S1 with a number of Subs that I have and the difference is night and day. The S1 provides all the highs and mids I need but just needs a kick to fill in that bottom end.

NOTE: There is one point that has not been made crystal clear here and I can see I need to mention that now. I use backing tracks in my show. So my need is beyond that of a singer/guitarist. I have drums and bass and percussion and pianos and organs and tubular bells.....well you get it. 

(Also most of the singer/guitarist I know have people sit in and in many cases the need for additional low end presents itself.)

Although I would argue that if you have some low end range on your voice and you use any Drop D tunings even for a singer/guitarist you need some additional low end.   

Cheers...two shows this weekend so excited. 

Happy Labor Day weekend everyone...have the time of your life.