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Nov 22, 2010

Re: system sounds as if it is compressed

Thank you everyone for all your input and help over the last few weeks.
Unfortunately I have now gave up hope on my L1, and have been using a hire pa for my last few gigs(as my old pa was sold to fund the L1).The bose im sure is a fantastic product but def not for me.
It got to the point where I absolutely hated going to a gig and using it because of its limitations, in fact I feel a bit duped by believing the hype, just wish I had spent more time researching and even reading more in this forum (seems i am not the only one who experienced the same probs).
Im sure at the same time the bose is marvelous in a concert venue where the audience is attentive and listening quietly, but not in the bar/club environments that I perform at.I am going to try to sell it privately after the christmas period and hopefully get some of my money back.

As for the people in this forum, I want to thank you for all your help and taking the time to reply to my posts



Davy.
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Jun 16, 2005

Re: system sounds as if it is compressed

I don't know about Ireland, but in the states, they go for about 90% of retail on eBay if they are in perfect condition.
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May 25, 2004

Re: system sounds as if it is compressed

Hi Davy,

It is really disappointing to me that you have been unable to use the L1 for your shows. I know it is not for everybody, but still mystified that it seems not to be loud enough, because I know some folks who use the L1 very, very loud.

Whatever your next step is I wish you the best of luck.

I would love to be able to see and hear you perform in one of the venues that has given you trouble, but Northern Ireland is a bit far to go for a pint. If you ever have a chance, record a tune or two live and share them with us.

Best Wishes,

O..

edit to correct spelling
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Apr 12, 2004

Re: system sounds as if it is compressed

Davy,
Man, I'm sorry to hear it didn't work out for you!

I am also very surprised that you are unable to get the volume you need, I have played some huge venues with my L1 over the last 6 years. In fact, we just played a huge convention center 2 weeks ago for a crowd of 700, and every lick of our performance was easily heard by all, all the way to the back wall. We ROCKED the place! Cool

One thing we did learn early on, was that it takes a lot less volume with L1 systems to get a great mix of sound to the back wall Wink

Anyway, I wish you the best of luck in whatever road you decide to take in regard to your gear!

Best Wishes,
Jeff
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Nov 22, 2010

Re: system sounds as if it is compressed

Guys thanks for replying and your kind comments wishing me all the best,
Gonna persevere another while, its obvious I am doing something wrong judging by the venues that you have used the L1 in, I mean its just too expensive a product not to be professional.
Have a few gigs over the next few days so will take another go at it and will report back soon.

Again thank you all and happy holidays.

Davy

http://www.davyk.net
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Apr 12, 2004

Re: system sounds as if it is compressed

Davey,
Glad to hear you aren't giving up yet!

It would be great if it were simply"operator error", but in reading through this thread, it seems you are doing everything you can do to get the system to perform at the level you need. At this point, you absolutely cannot rule out some type of gear malfunction.

Here is a link to a bar gig we did, the night after we played the convention center. Notice that the lead vocals have no problem cutting through using my Model II, as well as the second guitar parts on my Keytar. After gain staging, I probably had the trim on the mic channel at about 7, the channel volume at 6, and the Master volume at maybe 5 (I'm just "best guessing" here). I use a Sennheiser wireless headset mic (super-cardioid), so I have no way to avoid "eating the mic", which I'm sure helps. Everyone's vocals were direct into their individual T1 units, and completely flat just running the presets (no fx).

This was filmed with a camcorder set on a shelf in the back of the room, so not the best sound quality, but good enough to show that the system handled the gig effortlessly: Bombays Gig

Best Wishes,
Jeff
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Nov 22, 2010

Re: system sounds as if it is compressed

Hi everyone,
A small update for you all,
I used the bose for 2 gigs this weekand have had better results, why you ask? because i kept the system turned down.
Brief description of settings:
Channel 1 = mic: trim 6 channel vol 6
Channel 4 = tracks: trim 4 channel vol 7
and master volume at 5 (50%)
I find that any more volume (whether on channel volumes or master volume)and the mic compression sneaks in,although it sounded quiet on stage with me, the audience seemed happy enough and danced all night, dont know though what it sounded like at back of room but no complaints from them either.
I have to think of this system in an entirely different way than my old pa I believe, was very happy with the system for these gigs but still have the desire to turn it up though.
The two gigs were both in a bar/lounge type venue, not really that big a venues, but would still love to try another system to ease my mind.

Davy.

http://www.davyk.net
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Sep 12, 2010

Re: system sounds as if it is compressed

Hey Davy, glad you're starting to make some head-way. Where are you standing in relation to the L1 and at what distance. I still need to do some experimenting with my system, and have had some compression issues myself, as I mentioned before. I'm still a relatively new user and trying to learn as I go. I may be off base with this thought, it's something I intend to test, but I think there may be a correlation between the distance of the mic(s) to the L1 and the headroom that is available. Do you ever get a chance to sound-check at any of your gigs. I'm just wondering how loud you can get the backing tracks when there's no open mic. I'm wondering how much added signal from the L1 into the mic affects the headroom before compression, and if it does have an impact whats the best strategy to deal with it. Is there only a limiter on the pre amp? Or is there another later. One experiment I intend to try is backing way off on the trim and making up the gain at channel and master volume stages, just to see. Another thing I will try is body position, maybe my body can act as a shield to reduce the amount of L1 level bleeding back into the mic. One of the key features of the system, consistent level at greater distances actually makes this more difficult. Anyway, good luck and keep posting your findings, if I come up with anything useful I will post as well.
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Nov 22, 2010

Re: system sounds as if it is compressed

Hi Litesnsirens,
I now set the bose up beside me and slightly behind, just as I used to do with my old pa, I find the mic doesnt feedback as easy now.
As for compression, the system is great with one thing running ie,backing tracks, but when another source is added ie vocals thats when the compression/limiting occurs.
For example, Last gig I had the master set at 5 (50%) and adjusted the channel volumes accordingly to get the mix right. No compression or feedback was experienced until i turned the master up a little bit more (as the night went on and crowd got bigger and I felt i needed a little more volume to compensate for this).
And discos are awful, dont get me wrong the music playback is great but there is a stage where the system just doesnt get any louder as you turn up and when you try to get a bit of audience participation by announcing over the mic its then you notice that the mic sounds as tight and compressed and lost in the mix.
I believe, as do many of my fellow musicians who have heard me using the Bose, that this system is not designed as a conventional pa but to be used as part of a band whose members are using a system each, thus resulting in not too many sources being played through every system.
I have got to the stage now where I just go and do the gig, get paid and come home,the enjoyment has somewhat diminished.

Davy

www.davyk.net
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Jun 16, 2005

Re: system sounds as if it is compressed

quote:
Originally posted by Renegade:
As for compression, the system is great with one thing running ie,backing tracks, but when another source is added ie vocals thats when the compression/limiting occurs.


Basically, this is what I said a bunch of posts ago. Smile And it is why I use three "systems" (each one is a L1m2 and 2 B1s) for any large gig. One for the drum track, on for the backing track, and one for the vocals. Since the L1 system was designed to be used as on system per musician, the closer you can get your backing tracks to that, the happier you will be. I have a three piece gig coming up on Thursday (I am adding a sax and guitar to my backing tracks and vocals), and I think I will bring my 2 L1 Compacts in addition to the 3 L1m2, to keep their sounds from forcing mine into compression.