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Jay718
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Jul 28, 2018

Re: UPDATED JUNE 12th - MASTER: Play All not working correctly after 19.x update

Hi All....Jumping in to make myself known to Bose and to Share my "Bose Story":

I at this time, regret my QVC impulse buy of a Bose Wave radio. This Wave did not have built in bluetooth, so I got the great idea of buying a soundlink adapter. I really like my Beats speakers, but was looking forward to building something that was "whole home" (what a joke). Satisfied with the Wave, I added a ST20 and ST10 against my better half's judgement (why are women always right). While I am happy with individual speaker performance, my enitre purpose of having a whole home system has worked one time since 11/2017.

I have read the two closed threads and now the 26 pages of comment on this thread. I decided to fix the issue today and set up a guest network...well now nothing will connect.
This issue has not been happening since just May 2018....it has been happening long before.
My product is not fit for its particularly use/purpose.
If so few of us are affected, I wish Bose would look into rectifying this situation sooner rather than later.
I am deeply disappointed in the performance of the play all function and/or manually adding speakers as I have only been able to use this product as intended once. I am even more disappointed in Bose and the lack of response to do right by their customer. If fixes are not made soon, I will be unloading these on ebay and purchasing Sonos.
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AnameiaBR
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Jun 2, 2018

Re: MASTER: Play All not working correctly after 19.x update

Sorry Bose! You stink! The product you sell does not worth even the s*** word. You have no transparency whatsoever with your unfortunate ST consumers. You are too afraid of people starting to use the verb s against you, the one some of us used before you erased our mesages. I don’t know about the others in here but I am far from p***** off! You are messing too much with us and it is about time you stop saying your whatever team is checking and do something! Bull**bleep**ing time is over! I want solutions, otherwise I will most certainly do everything in my power to make this s*** hit the fan!
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MartinC
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Apr 10, 2018

Re: MASTER: Play All not working correctly after 19.x update

1. You can sell your speakers if you are out of warranty.
2. Send them back and ask for a refund if you are still protected by the warranty
3. Use Twitter handle/Instagram and Facebook and complain
4. Write negative yet fair reviews on the site where you bought the speakers (if purchased online)
5. Legal action (and now my post will be removed by Bose moderators)
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Mattyboy
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Jan 2, 2017

Re: MASTER: Play All not working correctly after 19.x update

I cant believe Bose are still selling the ST range of speakers. The speakers are clearly not performing as advertised.
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AnameiaBR
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Jun 2, 2018

Re: MASTER: Play All not working correctly after 19.x update

And yet they are confortably seated at home laughing at this handful bunch of sorry people who are angry at each other over some s*****y speakers that were meant to work together but don’t. Escalation team is having a drink with the money Bose gets selling STs. Bravo! Well done, you just prooved we are voiceless and will remained just like this. Rest my case.
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AlaskaMatt
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Jul 29, 2018

Re: MASTER: Play All not working correctly after 19.x update

I am having the same problem.  I have a feeling, based on experimentation, that I may have found the issue (although this is a funky thing specific to my environment, so perhaps not).

 

I have a few different routers in my configuration.  The edge router we'll call NH.  NH serves two wireless networks with similar names - N1 is a 2.4Ghz 802.11AC network.  N2 is a 5 Ghz 802.11AC network.  NH also serves a guest network, GUEST_N, which is 2.4Ghz 802.11N.  Behind NH (that is, inside the network) I also have an Apple TimeCapsule.  It is wired to NH, but for some reason will not let me turn off the WiFi.  As a result, it believes it is "Extending" N2.

 

I have 2 SoundTouch 10 speakers called LivingRoom and DiningRoom.  I can connect to either one, and usually both will show up in the app (although that is its own frustration - sometimes only one or neither appears).  When I PlayAll, it usually doesn't work.  It works intermittantly.  I believe what is happening is that the ST-10s are trying to connect to "N2".  Sometimes that connects them through NH, sometimes through the TimeCapsule.  It is pretty low probability that both will be on the same device, though.  When they are not on the same router, Play All will not work.

 

To test this, I would need to be able to quickly get into the network settings for the two ST-10s.  Rebooting, going through USB, or changing settings through an ad hoc wifi network are all a pain.  Changing the network settings on the router to test will be even more of a pain: I have dozens of devices that use these routers, and updating settings on all of them is untenable.  But when I did shut down the TimeCapsule, the Guest Network, and one of the networks on the edge router, the ST-10s both landed on the same router (necessarily) and Play All worked.

 

(BTW - wireless isolation is not turned on: I can see the entire network through IP whereever I am connected.  But broadcast (192.168.1.255 or whatever) will not work everywhere: it generally only returns the devices on the same router.)

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AlaskaMatt
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Jul 29, 2018

Re: MASTER: Play All not working correctly after 19.x update

h'okay!  I think I have good results to report.  This is long - sorry, just trying to be thorough.

 

Last night, I finally got sick of it after entertaining guests with no music.  After they left, I went back to the router to try something new.

 

I nuked all of the networks in my house.  That allowed me to disconnect the TimeCapsule, and finally turn its WiFi off (woohoo! small victory right there).  Back on the router, I created two new networks: B1 and B2.  B1 is an 802.11b,g,n at 2.4Ghz.  B2 is an 802.11AC at 5Ghz.  (Note - turned off Guest wifi entirely, which should signficantly reduce router load).  I have now connected just a small number of devices to the B1 network, including both ST10s.  Everything else is going onto B2.  But for now, nothing is on there except my laptop.

 

The ST10s are now working flawlessly (and quickly!  Much more responsive than they were).  Who knows how long it lasts, but for now it is cooking with butter.

 

I have two guesses for what was happening.  Curiously, neither is Bose's fault.  They are (rightly, in my opinion,) going to face a $#%@load of backlash from their handling of this situation, and NONE OF IT WILL BE BECAUSE OF THE TECHNICAL ISSUE.  That is disappointing.  Anyhow, onto the theories:

 

Theory 1) the ST10s were not all landing on the same wireless network, and for some reason were having trouble reaching one another across bridged networks.  I'm guessing they use something unrealiable (maybe UDP) to manage streaming between devices and make heavy use of broadcast IPs to find each other, and those don't propogate correctly across bridged networks.  Quick fix - make sure that all of your SoundTouch speakers are on the same wireless network, not just the same router.  Note that this would be REALLY hard for Bose to fix.  The natural fix, to use a fixed IP for each speaker, simply will not work on most home networks that use DHCP to assign IPs.  The next natural solution would be a hub and spokes configuration, which would require you to buy a Bose hub in order to manage your SoundTouch speakers.  That is something Bose was specifically designing to avoid (for which I am grateful - I would not have purchased the system if I had to bring home a separate hub, and I sure as heck would not have paid separately for one).  BTW - my best guess is that Sonos faces a similar issue.  Probably manifests as desync, disconnect from Amazon, or inability to play across multiple devices.

 

Theory 2) the devices could not see themselves in a see of network noise.  Either at the router or out in the ether, with a fairly saturated network the level of interference can be astonishing.  With 3 or 4 devices, it is probably not a significant problem particularly for reliable transmissions (TCP).  But get 20 devices on your (home) network and use an unreliable transmission (UDP) and things will spill all over the floor.  This could be because the router lacks enough computing power to handle the network topology or respond to the issue, or because wifi simply does not handle a stack of wireless signals in a clean way.  But probably the router thing.  Quick fix - kick stuff, particularly intensive stuff like streaming, off your network.

 

As a troubleshooting step, you might try the following:

 

  1. Remove the networks on your router.  Turn them all off.
  2. Create a new network on your router.  The ST-10, at least, can only see 802.11b,g,n: no need to set it up on your fastest 5Ghz network.  I'm guessing it's the same on the other SoundTouch speakers.  So set up a 2.4Ghz 802.11b,g,n network with a new name and new password.
  3. Plug a laptop into each of two of your SoundTouch speakers and set them up on this new network.  At the most, add one more.  Do NOT add more than three SoundTouch speakers to the network.  Do not add the laptop to the network, or your phone, or any other devices.  Network should just consist of speakers and a router.
  4. Do not put anything else on the network, and do not set up any other networks on your router.
  5. Now try playing something from one of the speakers, and PlayAll to the other.

 

If PlayAll works at this point, seems like network congestion or network bridging could be your issue.  You'll have to think about your network needs, but if possible for you it may be best to put your SoundTouch speakers on their own, dedicated wireless network (maybe even on their own router, which is somehow better to me than their own hub but I can't figure out why).

 

Bose, FYI - I am willing to give my speakers static IPs, or the speakers could keep in memory a simplified picture of the network topology, so speaker discovery should not be a thing.  I have a feeling that speaker discovery is creating a LOT of overhead on the network.  It should only happen when absolutely necessary.  For instance, if when the speakers land on a network they immediately identify all of the other speakers on the network and shake hands, then they can stagger their DHCP leases and only notify each other of IP changes.  But maybe I'm way off-base: I haven't looked at what traffic the SoundTouch speakers are actually sending around.  Bottom line - limiting me to 3 speakers per network is weird, arbitrary, and doesn't fit my needs.  Engineer around that limitation, please.

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4rron
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May 13, 2017

Re: MASTER: Play All not working correctly after 19.x update

You shouldn’t have to do all that though. Just as I shouldn’t have to buy a new router or a specific router or delve into settings on my current router and change things I shouldn’t be as an end user. It should just work.
Mattyboy
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Jan 2, 2017

Re: MASTER: Play All not working correctly after 19.x update


@4rron wrote:
You shouldn’t have to do all that though. Just as I shouldn’t have to buy a new router or a specific router or delve into settings on my current router and change things I shouldn’t be as an end user. It should just work.

Exactly right

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AlaskaMatt
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Jul 29, 2018

Re: MASTER: Play All not working correctly after 19.x update

First - I emphatically agree.  This is an engineering issue, and all this rigamarole should not be necessary.

 

Second - I spoke too soon: the fix was temporary, and now I can't find either speaker in the Soundtouch app.  I'll keep hacking on solutions, but color me unimpressed so far.